Onboard camera setups

[Simmo]

Looking to start a discussion on what people's ideas, opinions and suggestions are on best cameras and setups for onboard footage.
Considerations...
Picture quality?
Field of view (behind screen including dash or in front for clarity)?
Mounting for stability through bumps and vibration?
Ease of use?
Thanks in advance.


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[Mac III]

Go pros always look to have great clarity in the videos posted on line. Only from my pov

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[stevem]

I like to set it up to get as much information as possible , revs ,speed, gear, timer and track as possible. Track days are so few and far between the camera info can be as good as another half day and it doesn't lie unfortunately.

[zoidberg]

So true, I wish it did. It's brutal for me for turn one at the creek when I watch it back...

I have a go pro set up on my tank with a couple of extender bits to see the dash. Got a CBR1000 now and had to pack under the tank cover a fair bit to stop the image vibrating so much. I find from watching vids where you only see the track, as opposed to others where you can see tacho and the rest, one, (tacho vision) is useful, the other, not so much.

[Marshy]

Agreed about seeing the dash, but I'm yet to get a good dashcam setup on an Aprilia. The dash is relatively too high, and if the camera can see the track, it gets in the way!!

[Leezx10r]

Great topic Simon to start a discussion.

I am 100% in the market for a camera, after Joel was kind enough to lend me one on Thursday.

I also found the "tank" mount extra for data.

Owen has tried to show me many times "but I am a little blonde" how to overlay your solo data onto a video.

Camera wise, I will be going with a GoPro session 5 or a replyHD but more likely the GoPro after how easy Joel's was to use on Thursday "one button on the top with your gloves on"


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[Linden]

I'm investigating creating a 2 (or more) lens camera system based on a raspberry PI - not 100% yet but the aim is to have micro CCDs on a cables with the "camera" itself under the seat - but remember I'm an ideas man with lazy as my middle name :)

[Ruckos87]

My Garmin Virb elite is pretty good, it's a bit more slim line than the go pro, it has built in gps, and lap data. Which saves hours of editing. A massive down side to CCTV footage in my book. Also the record button is Massine so can be turned on with gloves on.
It also does G-forces and a few other things I've triedvto set it up so the dash can be seen as well as the track.
http://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20161230/54102917bb623b7e556c5ac975c2d3bf.jpg

https://youtu.be/ehYXS3_Ag-c

I'm keen to here about these 3D cameras though. A few pretty cool vids have popped up on Facebook over the past few mths.


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[Turbo]

I used the liquid image ego for years and they were great. One crash too many and I upgraded to a couple of GoPro's.
I have a Session and a Hero 4+. The quality improvement on both is huge and the one-click of the session is awesome.
The Hero4+ has been faultless but the Session has chopped in and out, missing a fair few laps!
I paid top dollar for the SD cards so I can only think it's not quite up the the vibrations of a swingarm?
Anyhow, for thw most part I love em!

[chicken16]

My Garmin Virb elite is pretty good, it's a bit more slim line than the go pro, it has built in gps, and lap data. Which saves hours of editing. A massive down side to CCTV footage in my book. Also the record button is Massine so can be turned on with gloves on.
It also does G-forces and a few other things I've triedvto set it up so the dash can be seen as well as the track.

This looks great! Does it take much set up for the included lap timing? I'm a bit of a spaz with this stuff and just like an easy to set up camera. Also, do you know how many Hz the GPS is? I was looking at the 360fly camera but now this might the way to go.

[Ruckos87]

This looks great! Does it take much set up for the included lap timing? I'm a bit of a spaz with this stuff and just like an easy to set up camera. Also, do you know how many Hz the GPS is? I was looking at the 360fly camera but now this might the way to go.

No set up at all. Works best if it's on for a bit prior to recording to grab the satellites. It's super easy to edit (why I got it initially)

Not sure of the gps but times are within .09 of my AiM


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[Simmo]

I was looking at the 360fly camera.

I borrowed one at P.I. And broadford.
It was really cool watching it back.
Securing it to fairing stay was very stable as it was for go pro. Only problem is no dash info.
2 cameras with overlay of footage might be a solution but a bit of extra fiddling and editing.
Setup...
http://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20161231/8298039394ee58ff15c77f4043436c55.jpg
360 fly T1 broadford...
http://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20161231/6aa54a9991ffb83a335f989277bb0545.jpg
Go pro Siberia PI...
http://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20161231/c9b60ce7e12a1367d9022d75346a376a.jpg


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[Simmo]

And here's one more. Going round the outside of a mate at T11 broadford.
http://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20161231/334bc1b07d2105c61eebfd30bcc6c625.jpg


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[Mr.Ed]

Best camera for motorsports atm is the Garmin VIRB Ultra 30... and by a long mile! Especially if you ride an Euro bike which usually allows you to easily hook up an OBDII sensor and etc. The camera has an internal 10Hz GPS which as fast as most good lap timers and with the OBD II sensor enabled it not only records but overlays A TON of info into your video. Its software gives you lots and lots of different templates so you can pick the one that suits you best.

Here is an example of what I'm talking about:


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fXnNpM7Ffj4&t=131s

Again, all that straight off the camera with almost no setup other than hooking up the OBD2 sensor. Even if you don't have the sensor, it will still give you lots more information than the gopro... and saves you from having to sync up gps data with the video and etc.

[chicken16]

No set up at all. Works best if it's on for a bit prior to recording to grab the satellites. It's super easy to edit (why I got it initially)

Not sure of the gps but times are within .09 of my AiM


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The prices of these are better than the GoPro's. Can you Bluetooth a GPS booster like Qstarz to improve the lap timing function?

[Ruckos87]

The prices of these are better than the GoPro's. Can you Bluetooth a GPS booster like Qstarz to improve the lap timing function?

Not sure. I don't think there a need, it's pretty accurate as stock.


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[Marshy]

Best camera for motorsports atm is the Garmin VIRB Ultra 30... .

That's an impressive video!


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[Mr.Ed]

That's an impressive video!


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Would have been my pick if I hadn't already bought the Gopro5... :/

[chicken16]

Since I've been looking for a camera and always like new shiny things, I just got the Ultra 30 with a handlebar mount. I just need to get to the track soon to post up some footage.

[Krackeye]

I've notices the 360Fly 4K has gps data as well. What are peoples thoughts on the 360' cameras? Novelty or a stayer?
Pretty sure there's no obdII on the blade (2009).

I like the look of that Garmin Ultra30 Chicken. Interested to see what you think regards ease of use ect. I guess if you forking out big dollars for a camera 4k is the way to go.

[Krackeye]

I used the liquid image ego for years and they were great. One crash too many and I upgraded to a couple of GoPro's.
I have a Session and a Hero 4+. The quality improvement on both is huge and the one-click of the session is awesome.
The Hero4+ has been faultless but the Session has chopped in and out, missing a fair few laps!
I paid top dollar for the SD cards so I can only think it's not quite up the the vibrations of a swingarm?
Anyhow, for thw most part I love em!

Owen, the Session apparently does not like the Sandisk Extreme for some reason. I had used the same card in my Hero3 Black with no probs but caused much grief with the Session.The Lexar Pro 1000x is meant to work more reliably. I'll see how mine goes on the 18th.

[Mr.Ed]

Since I've been looking for a camera and always like new shiny things, I just got the Ultra 30 with a handlebar mount. I just need to get to the track soon to post up some footage.

Looking forward to see the footage! ;)

[Turbo]

Owen, the Session apparently does not like the Sandisk Extreme for some reason. I had used the same card in my Hero3 Black with no probs but caused much grief with the Session.The Lexar Pro 1000x is meant to work more reliably. I'll see how mine goes on the 18th.

Ahaaaa!! That's heaps useful info, thanks Marcus! Keen to hear how it goes but the current ones are indeed Sandisk...

[Marshy]

What are peoples thoughts on the 360' cameras? Novelty or a stayer?

Novelty in its current form. Until it loses the massive fish-eye effect, the appeal is very very limited. It makes bike action look soooooooooo far away, even if you're bumping fairings. That said, so did the first GoPro. So in 10 years, everything will probably be 360 degree.


I guess if you forking out big dollars for a camera 4k is the way to go.

I respectfully disagree. The file size for editing and uploading to youtube is not worth it. It'd literally take days to upload a single race in 4k format. And besides, most computers (which let's be honest is where everyone watches youtube) aren't 4k capable, so you'd never see the high quality. Moreover (love that word) for fast action like bike racing a very high framerate is much more important than resolution. The advantage of a high-end 4k camera is to film in 720p at 120fps, rather than 4k at 15 or 30 fps, or even 1080 at 60fps. The action is smoother, slow motion replays hold twice (or more) as much detail etc. Buy a good camera for the framerate, not the resolution. I've got a 4k camera, but I film in 720p at 120fps. Smaller filesize, better action-picture quality, and you need to downsample it to have a realistically uploadable file size anyway, so the high detail is always lost.

My $0.02

[Krackeye]

Very good points Nick. Making sense again.

[Simmo]

Worth much more than 2 cents!


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[Mr.Ed]

I respectfully disagree. The file size for editing and uploading to youtube is not worth it. It'd literally take days to upload a single race in 4k format. And besides, most computers (which let's be honest is where everyone watches youtube) aren't 4k capable, so you'd never see the high quality. Moreover (love that word) for fast action like bike racing a very high framerate is much more important than resolution. The advantage of a high-end 4k camera is to film in 720p at 120fps, rather than 4k at 15 or 30 fps, or even 1080 at 60fps. The action is smoother, slow motion replays hold twice (or more) as much detail etc. Buy a good camera for the framerate, not the resolution. I've got a 4k camera, but I film in 720p at 120fps. Smaller filesize, better action-picture quality, and you need to downsample it to have a realistically uploadable file size anyway, so the high detail is always lost.

My $0.02

Mostly agree but... (there's always one, right?!) if you want a more cinematic image/experience (i.e. you want it to look more like the movies than amateur recordings) 30fps in 4K works a lot better. Ideally, 24fps. I do agree though that for the sheer sense of speed, the higher fps works better. Plus when you slow the image down, the extra fps really makes the slomo look good. 1080p@120fps is almost as big a file size as 4K@30fps though, so something to keep in mind.

Also, the upload speed varies wildly depending on what internet service/provider/etc you have... those on a decent NBN plan should have no trouble uploading files in 4K format.

Disclaimer: I don't use 4K to shoot stuff on the bike. But that's mostly because I very rarely watch my own stuff on TV and Youtube butchers 4K quality anyway so no point uploading it there (vimeo works a lot better though!).

[Marshy]

Good points also, Ed. I've never actually tried watching on the big screen. And I'm on cable internet, which is good downstream but woeful upstream! Your mileage may vary.


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[Mr.Ed]

And I'm on cable internet, which is good downstream but woeful upstream! Your mileage may vary.


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Same... speedpack and etc but still ridiculous upload speeds.

[chicken16]

So I ordered the Virb Ultra30 from digitalcamerawarehouse.com.au yesterday and it arrived this morning. Unfortunately they sent me the handlebar mount I ordered for the earlier version so it won't attach to the camera. On the upside, these fit all the GoPro mounts so I ordered one off eBay which should be here soon. Not wanting to put 3m tape all over my road bike I ran around the block with it to get an idea of using the compatible IPad app. This was sooo easy to use, even for someone who is computer illiterate like me. Adding speed, g's and an outline of the route is easy as. Lap times would be just as easy if I had gone around the block more than once. After using all types of cameras over the years, this is by far the easiest to use along with having the best features ever. Even the switch to start recording is big and will pose no problems for gloved hands. For those interested, I checked pretty much everywhere for one of these and the above business was the best overall - not the cheapest but not far off and great reviews. They are giving me a refund for the incorrect part the sent me. Now I just have to get to the track with it!

[Marshy]

Good tip, thanks!! Is it me, or do they not list the virb on the site??

[Ruckos87]

I just went through a few old vids. Some of the lap time data didn't pick up on my Virb, so it's probably worth running a seperate time. I did however just realise you can set it to auto recorded when motion is detected. Cool cause I often forget to flick the record switch.
I updated the firmware so hopefully that sorts the lap time faults on mine


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[Krackeye]

You should be able to tell the camera to start. eg "Ok Garmin, start". Same to stop it. Apparently it works beautifully.
I have a Garmin watch which BT's to the camera. be cool to see how much you HR rises when you have those puckering moments.

[Linden]

You should be able to tell the camera to start. eg "Ok Garmin, start". Same to stop it.

Work well in a garage pre race (thinking BEARS here)

[Ruckos87]

I have a Garmin watch which BT's to the camera. be cool to see how much you HR rises when you have those puckering moments.
Defiantly
I'd like to know the physical exertion of a track day. Got to burn more calories than a run along the Beach or a game of footy. I was absolutely rooted after last Thursday....



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[Krackeye]

I've seen 175bpm as a peak at the the track. A solid cardio workout and it's around 160-165. :boxing:

[chicken16]

Good tip, thanks!! Is it me, or do they not list the virb on the site??

I found it through a google search for the Virb but it's probably quicker to just phone them, which I ended up doing. One day for delivery was a bonus.

[chicken16]

I have a Garmin watch which BT's to the camera. be cool to see how much you HR rises when you have those puckering moments.

You can add a heap of sensors to the Virb including heart rate. I'll give that one a miss as I don't want to know :)

[Turbo]

Wow, I'd no idea the Garmin was that good! Wish I'd known before getting the GoPro.
Sync is a bit of a pain on the ass with data and more than one camera!

[Kimbo]

I looked at the Garmin when I was in Canada last year, I liked it's features , but it was a bit bulky. I am a Sony guy. So I use HDR-AZ1. Its very small and great features , It wifi's to my phone to start and stop and view. . I use it on my ski helmet and also I have an adapter so it fits go pro mounts.It's 4 K as well. Good battery length and stabilised. I mount it on my RSV4 facing forward, I also run a go-pro on the back , but half the time it shuts down , or doesnt start properly

[Simmo]

I found a camera guy at jb hifi who seemed to know his stuff.
Take home points to add to discussion:
1. Sony 4K action cam has "optical" stability feature which is the best at removing camera shake on bumps.
2. JB are trying to get garmin which he thinks is a great product but gets few requests for it.
3. They sell 400 GoPros a month! Popular product means continued development of technology and accessories and domination may result in some other brands leaving the action cam market all together. Session 5 is very compact.


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[Mr.Ed]

A bit more novelty to the whole thing



https://youtu.be/lBUV9bQza4I]


Forgot to charge the batteries that's why it goes wonky after a while lol

[Marshy]

That's fricken awesome!! Where did you get a gyro camera??? When it stopped working towards the end, I wanted it to go back to working again. It really really shows the elevation changes that are otherwise virtually invisible in on-board footage.

[Ruckos87]

That's very cool. Can you show us the camera? How would it stand up to a crash ??


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[Mr.Ed]

That's fricken awesome!! Where did you get a gyro camera??? When it stopped working towards the end, I wanted it to go back to working again. It really really shows the elevation changes that are otherwise virtually invisible in on-board footage.


I bought it on ebay when they had a $20off coupon thingy going... 128 delivery and I felt 108 was something I could part with in the event of a crash



That's very cool. Can you show us the camera? How would it stand up to a crash ??


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It would probably stand up as much as the camera would really... I reckon over the triples, where I have them mounted is still one of the safest places. I will however run it on the tail as well as I reckon it should be great for watching your body position... a lot more exposed there though.

As for where the camera/gimbal are mounted, 99% of ppl who see the picture or even look at the bike go "Fk... how the hell do you see the track???" and in all honesty it does not bother me at all. It's hard to tell from the video/pics but i's actually on the right side of the triple and it only covers like half the speedo when I'm tucked in, so fk all really. I have had the odd 'off the seat, near high side moment' and those are the only instances where I've hit my helmet on the camera. I've also broken a screen that way. Been thinking of making a mount to push the whole thing closer to the dash to try and mitigate that...

Here are a couple of shots:

19221923

[Ruckos87]

So is it an attachment to your existing go pro??? Like you say would be awesome on the rear for body position


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[Mr.Ed]

You wanna know the best bit? It fits better on the Garmin! ;)

[Ruckos87]

Link me link me I need one!!!!!


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[Mr.Ed]

I got it off these guys but it seems to have gone up in price... not sure if it's aussie dollar or what?

http://www.ebay.com.au/itm/201599068301?_trksid=p2057872.m2749.l2649&ssPageName=STRK%3AMEBIDX%3AIT

There are a couple a bit cheaper but not by much

It took about a week to get here and I was blown away by the quality of the components and etc... especially when compared to the price!

PS: Make sure to update the firmware when you get it!

[zoidberg]

Ed, that is bloody unreal! Thanks for sharing mate.

[Mac III]

That looks fantastic, May have to get a camera now ,

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[Metal-Man]

some of the reviews mentioned that the it dies randomly, others never mentioned it ... mixed reviews I guess. Either way, I like it.

[Mr.Ed]

Mine only died when the battery died really... then again, 1st time running it. Who knows...

[Turbo]

That's magic, Ed! Does it get in the way at all?

[Mr.Ed]

Not anymore than a regular gopro sitting there would... I have actually just been in the garage and moved it a bit. In my infinite wisdom, the 1st time I set it up, forgot that the thing moves and keeps it horizontal... so it doesn't actually need to be mounted at 90º as I always had my cameras! hahaha Now I've set it up skewed to the right even more, the only difference will be the camera sitting a bit lower than before

[Krackeye]

Was out at the Creek yesterday and got to play with the new camera. We got in 4 sessions for the day before the heavens opens. Also finally cracked the 40's with a 1.40.7. Not this sesh though.
Love the new camera. Amazing features and if you have OBDII even more. Unfortunately the Blade does not. From 2012 I think.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=csyUgkmuQdI

[zoidberg]

Nice Marcus! Heaps of info there. What damper do you have on yours? It gets pretty tankslap happy a couple of times there! Also, what gearing?

And that dreaded camera bounce... I calmed mine down a little by putting some foam under the tank cover, made it easier to watch.

Also, good work on the 40.7! I'm jealous...

[Marshy]

I reckon with the tank slappers!! Very, errr, exciting. Nice camera! I have camera envy.... ;)

[Krackeye]

Nice Marcus! Heaps of info there. What damper do you have on yours? It gets pretty tankslap happy a couple of times there! Also, what gearing?



Just stock mate. Yeah, first time I've had one like that. :wacko:

[Linden]

Heart rate seem a bit out of sequence was dropping while in turn 1 and only start up again after 2/3 ...

[Krackeye]

Heart rate seem a bit out of sequence was dropping while in turn 1 and only start up again after 2/3 ...

The faster I go the calmer and more zen like I become. :D
It is up and down though. It's measured from my watch so maybe not super accurate. I was surprised to see the heart rate so high. Similar to when I do some heavy cardio and it does explain why I sweat like a blind lesbian at the fish market .
(The above statement is for comedy reasons only and in no way do I liken the female anatomy to sea life)

[Ruckos87]

Nice one. I dream on a 140 next Friday


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